To Kill or Murder:

[OneJoe]

Many verses state not to kill.

Exo 20:13 Thou shalt not kill.
Deu 5:17 Thou shalt not kill.
Mat 5:21 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment:
Mar 10:19 Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Defraud not, Honor thy father and mother.
Rom 13:9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself.

Prov 6:16 These six things doth the LORD hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him:
Prov 6:17 A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood,
Pro 6:18 A heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief,
Pro 6:19 A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren.

Why would this passage say "innocent blood"? What is being related here, that a man under a particular circumstance is not "innocent"? Someone breaks in to your home with the intent to harm you and your family, does this make him no longer innocent? A man is found guilty without a doubt and is put to death by whatever means, is this justified?

Were told not to kill, in another case were told its an abomination to shed innocent blood.

I am not trying to justify any case of killing since we are told not to kill, but why would we be told not to shed innocent blood rather than just not to shed blood period. Does Prov 6:17 lay down a condition?


Onejoe

[EnterHisPresence]

Though I agree that killing is wrong, I also believe that in certain cases that it's not. For instance in the line of duty- police officers. Soldiers in defense of their country. If you notice that ther were many times that God commanded Israel to go to war and everytime he sent them to war, he told them to destroy everyone and everything...from man to beast.

Deu 20:17 But thou shalt utterly destroy them; namely, the Hittites, and the Amorites, the Canaanites, and the Perizzites, the Hivites, and the Jebusites; as the LORD thy God hath commanded thee:

1Sa 15:3 Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass.

Then there are God's commands/levitical laws where He demands death of certian sinners.
Lev 20:15-16 And if a man lie with a beast, he shall surely be put to death: and ye shall slay the beast. And if a woman approach unto any beast, and lie down thereto, thou shalt kill the woman, and the beast: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.

Lev 20:27 A man also or woman that hath a familiar spirit, or that is a wizard, shall surely be put to death: they shall stone them with stones: their blood shall be upon them.

So I think the understanding of thou shalt not kill...is meaning an innocent person.

[Godsent]

Many verses state not to kill.

Exo 20:13 Thou shalt not kill.
Deu 5:17 Thou shalt not kill.
Mat 5:21 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment:
Mar 10:19 Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Defraud not, Honor thy father and mother.
Rom 13:9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself.

Prov 6:16 These six things doth the LORD hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him:
Prov 6:17 A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood,
Pro 6:18 A heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief,
Pro 6:19 A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren.

Why would this passage say "innocent blood"? What is being related here, that a man under a particular circumstance is not "innocent"? Someone breaks in to your home with the intent to harm you and your family, does this make him no longer innocent? A man is found guilty without a doubt and is put to death by whatever means, is this justified?

Were told not to kill, in another case were told its an abomination to shed innocent blood.

I am not trying to justify any case of killing since we are told not to kill, but why would we be told not to shed innocent blood rather than just not to shed blood period. Does Prov 6:17 lay down a condition?


Onejoe
Exodus 20:13 should read this way- Thou shalt not murder. Murder is a preplanned thing were u think upon it and act. If u was to drive out a church parking lot and accidently hit someones car and kill them have u broken one of the commandments? no u have not. When people go to war and have to kill people to keep our freedom thats killing but not murder theirs no broken commandment there. Cuz God said"their will be a time of war and a time of peace." he realized war would be needed and he didnt mean that the commandment was broke while doing so. Also their were times in the bible were people were commanded to stone someone. Killing yes, murder no. Thier are times in which the Exodus commandment is justified on what needs to be done for the better of the people. Capital Punishment is sometimes necessary to stop the crime from continuing on. Killing again but not murder cuz think of all the lives that are being saved by establishing harsh judgement in a situation. This really goes along with serial killers that kill and keep on killing and its all premediated and everything is this murder and killing?yes it is and the commandment has been broken.

[Bikn4God]

Hey Joe,

Murder can be determined as a killing based upon malice or premeditation. The killing of an innocent person by malicious intent.

There's all kinds of killing...

We could accidently kill an innocent person. Perhaps a car accident or other type of tragedy. The person would indeed be dead. But the premeditation or malicious intent would not be there.

We could kill as a soldier. Defending our country. There are so many stories in the Bible of armies and soldiers. God ordered the invasions of many places Himself.

I sincerely think that if there is malicious intent, that constitutes murder. If one seeks revenge and kills, that shows malicious intent.

Self-Defense.... defending ourselves from assault, or assault on our families or an innocent person. Not malicious, but justified.

I think "innocent blood" is the key. And killing out of malice. All are wrong.

God Bless,

CJ

[Godsent]

Hey Joe,

Murder can be determined as a killing based upon malice or premeditation. The killing of an innocent person by malicious intent.

There's all kinds of killing...

We could accidently kill an innocent person. Perhaps a car accident or other type of tragedy. The person would indeed be dead. But the premeditation or malicious intent would not be there.

We could kill as a soldier. Defending our country. There are so many stories in the Bible of armies and soldiers. God ordered the invasions of many places Himself.

I sincerely think that if there is malicious intent, that constitutes murder. If one seeks revenge and kills, that shows malicious intent.

Self-Defense.... defending ourselves from assault, or assault on our families or an innocent person. Not malicious, but justified.

I think "innocent blood" is the key. And killing out of malice. All are wrong.

God Bless,

CJ
Exactly and Romans explains a little about the justification you speak of... Romans 2:13-(For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.