Baptism

[tammy78]

Hi. I'm new here and have a question that has bugged me for a while, and I'm interested in others opinions.
I have studied with bible with certain churches and organisations and have never been fully satisfied with them. There has been certain practices or beliefs that they have had that just didn't feel right to me. God has always been with me, though I have been in and out of his life.
I am now at a blessed place in my life. I have never felt so close to God before. I read the bible every day, I pray often, I feel extremely close to God, I feel him with me and my family all the time, I talk about Christian matters with like-minded friends, and I am not involved with any church or organisation. At this time in my life I feel I am doing the right thing, and if I am wrong, I know that God will correct me when he feels I am ready.
I want to know can you get baptised without being baptised into a church. Do you have to be baptised by someone else? Can baptism be a personal thing that is done in private and is just between you and God?

[allthingspure]

If you will study the Book of Acts I believe it will help.
I personally believe that it is important to be baptized by someone who (that you know without a doubt) is a true man of God.
I dont think you would need to be baptized in a church....I was baptized in a swimming pool! Water is water lol. Some get baptized in a river. I don't think that it matters where as long as you are buried in the name of Jesus Christ.
Because it is with Him that we are buried! Read Romans 6:3-4 > Therefore are"buried with him by baptism into death:" When we are baptized with the Spirit it is then we are resurrected with By Him to live in newness of life...we will be new creatures :)
Also Colossians 2:12 > Buried with Him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with Him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.

Some believe that those scriptures are speaking of spiritual baptism....but if that were true then Acts 2:38 would not say what it says >>
Repent ( to repent is something we must do)
Be Baptized ( to be baptized requires action on our part)
Then it goes on to say "and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost" receiving the Holy Ghost is being baptized with the Spirit!( Jesus only can baptize us with the Spirit)
* Whatsoever ye do in word or deed do All in the name of Jesus :)
Matthew 28:19 Jesus speaking > Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them ( I'll stop here for a note ...If water baptism were not nessary the Lord would not have told His disciples to "baptize them" only Jesus can baptize with the Spirit, man cannot do that!) Jesus was speaking about water baptism. Ok back to the verse >> Baptizing them in the "name" (one name singular) of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost.
In order to obey this scripture we must get baptized in the "Name" of the Father, Son and Holy Ghost.Jesus said >> I have come in my Fathers Name....
So "Jesus" is the Father's name...the name of the Son...Jesus.....the Holy Ghost.. is sent in Jesus' name > John 14;26 > But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in "My name" (Jesus) he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.
In the book of Acts they always baptized in the name of Jesus for the remission of sins.....This is where we must rightly divide Gods word.
We must do it Gods way..any other way is done in vain.
God Bless You!

allthingspure

[SirLaffalot aka CarltonRoss]

Baptism is a personal, individual thing, not a Church thing-- baptism is an outward manifestation of an inward work of grace and through baptism, you are sharing with Jesus in his death and resurrection. This can be done on a creek bank, in a lake or in a tub of water, it doesn't matter. However, you should be careful to be baptized by a fellow believer, but I'm sure you all ready thought of that.

Be blessed.

Sir Laffy

[foundinHim]

I pray in the Lord Jesus Christ's name that these Scriptures give you the answers to your questions...

(Col.2:8-15) Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ: for in Him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him, Which is the head of all principality and power: In Whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh, by the circumcision of Christ: Buried with Him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with Him through the faith of the operation of God Who hath raised Him from the dead. And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath He quickened together with Him, having forgiven you all trespasses; Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to His cross; And having spoiled principalities and powers, He made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.

[Curt]

I want to know can you get baptised without being baptised into a church. Do you have to be baptised by someone else? Can baptism be a personal thing that is done in private and is just between you and God?

Tammy, if someone is telling you to get baptized into their church I would have to say no to it. First of all I would say that when you were reborn by the Spirit of God, it was the Holy Spirit that did the real baptizing. So yes it is personal and has already been done. However I would suggest that it's a great thing to also go and be baptized physically by a pastor. Our Lord commands us to do so... I would rejoice if I were you and go for it, obviously the Lord has put this on your heart.

May God Bless you,

Curt

[Rylee]

This is how it worked at the church I used to attend: if you wanted to become a member, you had to be baptised by the current pastor on a Sunday after services in front of the entire congregation. I'm not saying that I necessarily agree with this, but this is just how they did it. This was the only way to become a member, unless you had a health condition or some other reason why you couldn't be baptised. I feel that if you want to become baptised in a private setting, that's between you and God, and I don't see anything wrong with that. The only problem is, if you join a church that requires for you to be baptised and you don't have a certificate from the church who performed the service, then they could possibly tell you it's not valid. I don't know how many churches require this, I just know of my personal experiences. I would suggest being baptised by someone else, but I don't know if it's required.

If there is a particular church that you are a member of, or a church that you are interested in joining, you could always ask advice of their pastor, and ask about their particular rules and regulations. I hope this helps.

[OneJoe]

If you have no Pastor as I do not, can you be baptised in water? I think not. Now is water baptism going to get you saved? No. Is water baptism required? No. There is only one baptism that now saves and it is the baptism of the Holy Spirit. 1Pe 3:21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ: Eph 4:5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism, Eph 4:6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

[RachelAnne]

Well, I wasn't baptised until I was 15. My father (real father) never wanted me baptised but my step father did. he always said he would NEVER choose my religion for me so for a couple years I (like you) experimented with different religeons. Finally I decided that the one that was right for me was right in front of me. I told my step dad I was ready to be baptised and he was happy. Talking with my pastor, he told me that i didn't have to be baptised in front of the church. It's not the special holy water it's the blessings they say over it and over you. You could be baptised in a public bathroom if you wanted to. I would join a church or talk to a pastor or minister about being baptised privetly. They will never turn you down!

Rachel

[Word]

This is where your aswer is:

The baptism of John, whence was it? from heaven, or of men? And they reasoned with themselves, saying, If we shall say, From heaven; he will say unto us, Why did ye not then believe him? But if we shall say, Of men; we fear the people; for all hold John as a prophet. And they answered Jesus, and said, We cannot tell. And he said unto them, Neither tell I you by what authority I do these things. Matthew 21:25-27:)

I believe the answer is BOTH.

[jesusrocksmypinksocks]

Hi. I'm new here and have a question that has bugged me for a while, and I'm interested in others opinions.
I have studied with bible with certain churches and organisations and have never been fully satisfied with them. There has been certain practices or beliefs that they have had that just didn't feel right to me. God has always been with me, though I have been in and out of his life.
I am now at a blessed place in my life. I have never felt so close to God before. I read the bible every day, I pray often, I feel extremely close to God, I feel him with me and my family all the time, I talk about Christian matters with like-minded friends, and I am not involved with any church or organisation. At this time in my life I feel I am doing the right thing, and if I am wrong, I know that God will correct me when he feels I am ready.
I want to know can you get baptised without being baptised into a church. Do you have to be baptised by someone else? Can baptism be a personal thing that is done in private and is just between you and God?
Hey Im not sure and im new here as well so i don't know what i'm doing but in my church we are baptised in a service which says you have asked jesus into your life and after you are baptised you become a member of the church but before you are completely a member of the church you have to say a pray in front of the full church. I myself i haven't been baptised yet and don't want to until im older...im quite shy to do it yet but someday i will

[jesusrocksmypinksocks]

[QUOTE=jesusrocksmypinksocks]Hey Im not sure and im new here as well so i don't know what i'm doing but in my church we are baptised in a service which says you have asked jesus into your life and after you are baptised you become a member of the church but before you are completely a member of the church you have to say a pray in front of the full church. I myself i haven't been baptised yet and don't want to until im older...im quite shy to do it yet but someday i will. But will you be able to help me?....I want to be more in the presence of God but i feel too ashamed and embrassed to praise him by lifting my hands up. In my church we have a club for teens i go to and the pastor asked us raise our hands and stand up if we wanted to be closer to God but i never did. Could you suggest a way to get rid of the feeling? Dont worry if you cant

[jesusrocksmypinksocks]

:r [QUOTE=jesusrocksmypinksocks]Hey Im not sure and im new here as well so i don't know what i'm doing but in my church we are baptised in a service which says you have asked jesus into your life and after you are baptised you become a member of the church but before you are completely a member of the church you have to say a pray in front of the full church. I myself i haven't been baptised yet and don't want to until im older...im quite shy to do it yet but someday i will. But will you be able to help me?....I want to be more in the presence of God but i feel too ashamed and embrassed to praise him by lifting my hands up. In my church we have a club for teens i go to and the pastor asked us raise our hands and stand up if we wanted to be closer to God but i never did. Could you suggest a way to get rid of the feeling? Dont worry if you cant
:r

[Word]

This is where your aswer is:

The baptism of John, whence was it? from heaven, or of men? And they reasoned with themselves, saying, If we shall say, From heaven; he will say unto us, Why did ye not then believe him? But if we shall say, Of men; we fear the people; for all hold John as a prophet. And they answered Jesus, and said, We cannot tell. And he said unto them, Neither tell I you by what authority I do these things. Matthew 21:25-27:)

I believe the answer is BOTH.

Isn't such a great marvel how and why Elohim works with us?:)

[Just Christian]

I think many ministers will baptise you if you ask them to. The main thing is that you have committed yourself to Christ. I know both of my parents weren't baptized til they were in their 50's and the minister came to the house and baptized them because they wanted to do it in private and didn't attend church anywhere.

[Just Christian]

and as far as looking for a minister that you know for sure is a true Christian? You can never really be sure. I was baptized by a person that I later learned was not even a believer. God knows my heart and baptism was still valid.

[blueheron32]

Are you saying immersion is the only acceptable mode of water baptism Allthingspure??? If so....where is an example of immersion described....??

blue

[allthingspure]

Yes sir Blue, I believe it is !
Romans 6:4-5 > In these verses the words "Buried" and "Planted" are used. I think we all understand the meaning of these words. When we bury or plant something it is "completely put under and covered up." It stands to reason if we are buried and planted with Christ in baptism, we should be buried in water when baptized.
Col.2:12 > "Buried" with Him in baptism.......
Also thru out the book of Acts you will find that those who were baptized went completely into the water. If being sprinkling were good enough why did not they just grab a cup of water instead of going into the river? :)
The word baptize in Greek...baptizo...to make whelmed (fully wet) the word whelmed...to cover wholly with a fluid.

God Bless You Blue !
Allthingspure

[ohiogin]

Are you saying immersion is the only acceptable mode of water baptism Allthingspure??? If so....where is an example of immersion described....??

blue

1. Jesus was baptized that way.
"As soon as Jesus was baptized. He went up out of the water" Matthew 3:16

2. Every baptism in the Bible was by immersion. example
"...then both Phillip and the man went down into the water and Phillip baptized him. When they came up out of th ewater.." Acts 8:38-39

The word Baptize means "To dip under water"
The Greek word baptize means "to immerse or dip under water

The best symbolized a burial and resurrection!

[ohiogin]

I was baptized just today... my father immersed me and my son.. the Pastor was present and did ask me if I have accepted Jesus into my heart before my father submerged me. I don't think you need to have it done in a church.. I've seen it done in many places... as long as you can answer the question about accepting Jesus Christ into your heart... I believe anyone can baptize you.

[CarltonRoss aka SirLaffalot]

I think the following scripture reference will add sufficiently to those before me.

Col 2:12 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with [him] through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.

[blueheron32]

allthingspure...

can you give me one such example where a person is described as being completely submerged in water when baptized...?? I am not aware of anyplace, where the language of scripture describes such a thing..

blue

[Led]

Is water baptism going to get you saved? No.

Is water baptism required? No. If so, what for?

There is only one baptism that now saves and it is the baptism of the Holy Spirit.

[allthingspure]

Hi Led :)
I noticed your post and wanted to respond, hope you dont mind :)
You asked, "Is water baptism going to get you saved?" I say Yes, but its not the water that saves its the act of obedience.:)
You asked, "Is water baptism required?" I say Yes
There is one baptism of the Spirit and, one water baptism.
Now, I will tell you why I say Yes to your questions.
I will start out by saying, that the word baptize in Greek means to wash,to make whelmed, or to make fully wet
Baptism also has the same meaning.
Many believe that when the Bible speaks of baptism, it is speaking of Spiritual baptism only. But it is not, and here is why.... Matt.28:19 > Jesus is talking to His disciples, He is telling them what "they" are to do. He said "Go ye therefore, and teach all nations baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost.
Jesus was speaking of water baptism, He would not tell His disciples to baptize with the spirit, only He Himself can do that. Jesus was telling them to go and make fully wet, and wash those who believe.
Mark 16:16 . He that believeth and is baptized (made fully wet and washed)
shall be saved;he that believeth not shall be damned.
What is water baptism for? It is for the remission and washing away of sins.When a person believes and obeys their sins will be washed away.
Acts 2:38> Then Peter said unto them repent, and "Be baptized"(Be washed)
for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost(Which is Spiritual baptism) Acts 22:16 And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized,and wash away thy sins,calling on the name of the Lord.
You will notice all those who believe were always baptized in water. Acts 2:41 Then they that gladly received his word Were baptized. All of those who believe Will be baptized in water to wash away thrir sins
Acts 8:12> But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God,and the name of Jesus Christ,they were baptized,both men and women** He that believeth And is baptized shall be saved** Acts 8:36 Philip and the eunuch went "down into the water"
and Philip baptized him (washed and made him fully wet)Acts !0-47 > Can any man forbid water that these should not be baptized(washed) which have received the Holy Ghost (spiritual baptism)as well as we? Also Acts 18 & 18 > They Believed And were baptized. Notice it always says, they that believed were baptized! It goes hand in hand ! Believe = faith and being baptized = works > faith and works go hand in hand :)Acts 19:5 & 6 is a good example of water baptism And Spiritual baptism. v.5 When they heard this, they were baptized(washed) in the name of the Lord Jesus. v.7 > And when Paul had laid his hands on them, the Holy Ghost (They were baptized with the Spirit) came upon them; and they spake with tongues,and prophesied.
Water baptism is also a burial as well as a washing.
Romans 6:3-5 > Know ye not,that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized unto His death? Therefore we are buried with HimBy baptism into HIs death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in nwness of life.
For if we have been planted together in the likeness of His death, we shall be also in the likeness of His resurrection. (speaking of spiritual baptism)>1 Cor.12-13 For by one Spirit we are "baptized into one body" Being baptized by the Spirit puts is in the body (Water baptism washes us, and buries us into His Death.) Once we have been buried into His death by water baptism, then we are baptized into His body by Spiritual baptism.
1Cor.15-29> Else what shall they do which are baptized ( buried,washed)for the dead if the dead rise not at all?
Gal.3:27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. Col.2 :12>> Buried with Him in baptism(washed, made fully wet) wherein also ye are risen with Him (thru spiritual baptism)thru the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised HIm from the dead.
1 Peter 3:12 The like figure where baptism doth also now save us(its) not the putting away of the filth of the flesh. but, the answer of a good conscience toward God by the resurrection of Jesus Christ.
It is not because of the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but because of our obedience, so that we can have a good conscience toward God.
We must obey the plan and operation of God with out question!
2 Kings chapter 5 >> Naaman the leper, was told to go dip seven times in the river Jordon....He almost didn't do it..it didnt make sense to him. But then he went...it wasnt the water that cleansed him! It was his obedience :) We must obey Gods operation, and plan for salvation !

God Bless you !
allthingspure :)

[Led]

so you're saying if we don't get water baptized then we're not saved and we won't go to Heaven. I really don't know where to begin.

About salvation:
Using Mark 16:16 is a weak argument. Using Matt.28:19 and Acts 2:38 is also weak. I can say it simply doesn't say water baptism and that you're read into it too much. I can say it's the baptism of the Spirit. God is the one who saves, but He uses us to GO and He works THROUGH us. I could go on and on, but that would get boring. The Word of God is simple to understand that even a child can receive... it's simply by faith.

Eph 2:8,9 "For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast."

About cleansing/washing:
1 John 1:7-9if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin. If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

It's the blood of Christ that cleanses us now. In the OT it was by water, symbolic of the new, by the blood when we confess our sins by faith.
Without faith it's impossible to please God. We are justified by faith and not of works.

Nowhere in Paul's letters does it say anything about water baptisms. hum....

[Led]

Go ahead and get water baptized.

I'm just saying that water baptism isn't going to get you saved and it isn't required.

There is only one baptism that now saves and it is the baptism of the Holy Spirit.

[allthingspure]

Led
I think maybe you misunderstood me. :) I am not trying to make an argument. None of the scriptures that are in Gods word are weak.
Yes the blood of Jesus cleanses us.....When we obey His Words
Did you really take the time to read and try to understand what I was saying?
I am not trying to argue.:) Have you studied and looked up the word baptism for yourself? Do you think the scriptures that I gave are meaningless? You quote scripture yourself, do you think it is wise to use some and ignore the others? Do you think that God would put examples in His word for us to follow, and then say it dosent matter? We are to fulfill all righteousness.
Please do be so quick to ignore some scriptures and hold to others, we must rightly divide the word, to get the full meaning.

God Bless you Led!
allthingspure

[Led]

He also drank wine but that doesn't mean it's an example for us to follow.

When did I say that scripture was weak??? I said your argument is weak in using those scriptures. Please don't misquote me. And yes I took time to read all that you said. Have I studied this topic? Yes, a lot. If you want me to "not ignore some scriptures that you use then answer some of mine at least.

1st Peter 3:21 "The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:" The only baptism that saves men now is the "answer of a good conscience toward God," which means that man must take heed to and apply the WORD (Testimonies, Laws, Statutes and Commandments) through Christ (spiritual baptism) to his life, and "not the putting away of the filth of the flesh" (dirt) by sprinkling or washing the body with water (literal water baptism).

Since baptism is the single means by which (according to New Testament exegesis) one can contact the blood of Christ, then BAPTISM IS THE POINT AT WHICH ONE'S SINS ARE REMITTED. Therefore, the Gospel routinely declares that baptism saves or takes away sins. ". . . Repent, and be baptized everyone of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins . . ." (Acts 2:38). "He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved . . ." (Mark 16:16). "And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord" (Acts 22:16). ". . . baptism doth also now save us . . ." (1 Pet. 3:21).

It is recorded in Matthew the 3rd chapter how John the Baptist taught repentance in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ. Along with these teachings John the Baptist began to baptize the people in Jerusalem, Judaea, and the region around the Jordan. Matthew 3:5-6 “Then went out to him Jerusalem, and all Judaea, and all the region round about Jordan, And were baptized of him in Jordan, confessing their sins.”

When John the Baptist was baptizing the Israelites, he explained that Jesus Christ would baptize with the Holy Spirit. Matthew 3:11 "I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:" In Matthew 3:11 John the Baptist shows us that the baptism that he was performing would be perfected by Christ, and that baptism by water would no longer be performed with literal water, but through the Spirit.

[Bradley]

Is water baptism going to get you saved? No.

Is water baptism required? No. If so, what for?

There is only one baptism that now saves and it is the baptism of the Holy Spirit.
Baptism is not required to received God's gift of eternal life. It is something that most christians want to do as acknowledgment of their faith in God. Look at the thief on the cross next to Jesus who asked that Jesus remember him when he came into his kingdom. Certainly the thief who was also hanging on a cross never was baptised and Jesus told him that today he would be with him in paradise.

[allthingspure]

1st Peter 3:21 "The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:"

When we obey Gods word and Be baptized ( in water for the remission of sins)it gives us a good concience toward Him, because we have obeyed His commandment. What saves us is not the putting away the filth of the flesh (being baptized in water) but the "act of obedience" toward Him by being baptized in water.

Acts 2:38 >> Repent, and Be baptized (Water baptism) everyone of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, And ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost(spiritual baptism)

He that believeth(faith) And is baptized(in water ,which is works) shall be saved (meaning baptized with the spirit)
Faith without works is dead:)

These words that you said are true:)
Since baptism is the single means by which one can contact the blood of Christ, then BAPTISM IS THE POINT AT WHICH ONE'S SINS ARE REMITTED. Therefore, the Gospel routinely declares that baptism saves or takes away sins. ". . . Repent, and be baptized everyone of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins . . ." (Acts 2:38). "He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved . . ." (Mark 16:16). "And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord" (Acts 22:16). ". . . baptism doth also now save us . . ." (1 Pet. 3:21).

John the Baptist baptized unto repentence Matt. 3:11 "I indeed baptize you with water unto repentence: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:"
Never will you find that water baptism was done away with!
Matt.3:13-15 > Jesus Himself was baptized in water to fulfill all righteousness.
If water baptism had been done away with why did the disiples continue to baptize? Not only did they baptize those who believed, they rebaptized those that John baptized After Jesus was taken up and the Holy Ghost was sent they began to baptize in "Jesus name" for the "remission of sins."
You seem to think that when the Bible speaks of baptism it is speaking of only spiritual baptism of the Holy Ghost, but it is not.
Acts 19:2-6>> speaks of water baptism And Spiritual baptism
v.2 > He (Paul) said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, we have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.v.3 > And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptised? And they said, Unto John's Baptism. v.4> Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism unto repentence, saying unto the people, that they should believe on Him which should come after him, that is on Jesus Christ. v.5 > When they heard this they were baptized in the name of Lord Jesus. v.6> And when Paul had laid his hands upon them,the Holy Ghost came on them (spiritual baptism)and they spake with tongues and prophesied.
If a person does not "believe" the Gospel of Jesus Christ, which states repentence and baptism in His name they will not be saved. If a person truely believes they will be baptized in Jesus name for the remission of ther sins. He that believeth not shall be damned.
I think the problem is understanding the difference between water baptism and the baptism of the Holy Ghost. :)

God Bless You!
allthingspure

[foundinHim]

As to baptism...there is some confusion and controversies that arise as to doctrine and practice. John the Baptist, known as the baptizer, was not a minister of the Gospel of the Grace of God, but a prophet under the old covenant appointed to "prepare the way of the Lord," who came "to confirm the promises made unto the fathers" (Rom.15:8). John's ministry was unique and his message was "Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand" and he baptized with water, for those who believed his preaching and confessed their sins. The water baptism can be traced back to the Levitical washings in the O.T. The reason why John baptized with water, was that Jesus Christ would "be made manifest to Israel". (John 1:31-34) Israel needed signs, gifts, and wonders, to believe that Jesus Christ was the King and Saviour, sent by God the Father.

Whereas we, the body of Christ, "blessed are they that have not seen, and yet believed." Our baptism now, is by the Holy Spirit into Christ and His finished work, by God's grace through faith. This is a spiritual baptism done without hands or water. In the N.T., we see the Kingdom was rejected, and the King crucified. Immediately following this, when baptism was administered, not once do we find any of the apostles, or any of the first preachers of the Gospel of God's Grace, using water baptisms. Peter said to the dispersion (those who believed) : "Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ." And "commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord." Peter and John "baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus." In Rom.6:3, Paul speaks of "many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ"... There is not one exception to this practice.

It is written in Matt.28:19-20 "Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded of you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world." Amen.

By "rightly dividing" God's Word of Truth, we shall find, there is no longer need for two(2) baptisms---only one(1) baptism, and that is done by the Holy Spirit. All is Spiritual. In Ephesians, Phillipians, Colossians, and the Pastoral Epistles, there is no mention of any ordinances; except to emphasize the fact that they no longer exist. All are done away in the completeness, which is ours "in Christ." No question of infant baptism, or of sprinkling, pouring, or immersion, can arise where all is spiritual and Divine.

This doctrine becomes difficult for those who are reading the commands that refer to the past dispensation into the present one. If we "rightly" divide them, all difficulties are at once removed.

In His Service,
"found in Him", your sister in Christ

[Led]

As to baptism...there is some confusion and controversies that arise as to doctrine and practice. John the Baptist, known as the baptizer, was not a minister of the Gospel of the Grace of God, but a prophet under the old covenant appointed to "prepare the way of the Lord," who came "to confirm the promises made unto the fathers" (Rom.15:8). John's ministry was unique and his message was "Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand" and he baptized with water, for those who believed his preaching and confessed their sins. The water baptism can be traced back to the Levitical washings in the O.T. The reason why John baptized with water, was that Jesus Christ would "be made manifest to Israel". (John 1:31-34) Israel needed signs, gifts, and wonders, to believe that Jesus Christ was the King and Saviour, sent by God the Father.

Whereas we, the body of Christ, "blessed are they that have not seen, and yet believed." Our baptism now, is by the Holy Spirit into Christ and His finished work, by God's grace through faith. This is a spiritual baptism done without hands or water. In the N.T., we see the Kingdom was rejected, and the King crucified. Immediately following this, when baptism was administered, not once do we find any of the apostles, or any of the first preachers of the Gospel of God's Grace, using water baptisms. Peter said to the dispersion (those who believed) : "Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ." And "commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord." Peter and John "baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus." In Rom.6:3, Paul speaks of "many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ"... There is not one exception to this practice.

It is written in Matt.28:19-20 "Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded of you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world." Amen.

By "rightly dividing" God's Word of Truth, we shall find, there is no longer need for two(2) baptisms---only one(1) baptism, and that is done by the Holy Spirit. All is Spiritual. In Ephesians, Phillipians, Colossians, and the Pastoral Epistles, there is no mention of any ordinances; except to emphasize the fact that they no longer exist. All are done away in the completeness, which is ours "in Christ." No question of infant baptism, or of sprinkling, pouring, or immersion, can arise where all is spiritual and Divine.

This doctrine becomes difficult for those who are reading the commands that refer to the past dispensation into the present one. If we "rightly" divide them, all difficulties are at once removed.

In His Service,
"found in Him", your sister in Christ

Amen sister!

[allthingspure]

It amazes me how people can read Gods word and use the part they want to use and ignore the other. You will not find it anywhere in Gods word that water baptism no longer exist! If water baptism was important for Jesus and all of those thousands of people who were baptized..what makes you think its not important for us today? Are we anymore righteous than they that we don't need it? I think not! And who is this person that "done away with it" it sure wasn't Jesus, He told His disciples to go baptizing them..and He didn't change His mind. :)
I notice that Acts 2:38 is often quoted, yet part of it is left out, the part where Peter said "and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost" (which is spiritual baptism:)
The truth of the matter is a person who denies water baptism does not believe, because if they did they would be baptized for the remission of sins.
The Church that Gods established was started and built on and around Jesus Christ, everything He did and taught is the foundation for our salvation.
Every word of God has a purpose, and if we ignore it just because we "think" it dosent matter, then we do not know Him nor are we a believer of His word.
A true "believer" believes every Word that comes from God!

God Bless :)
allthingspure

[Led]

It amazes me how people can read Gods word and use the part they want to use and ignore the other. You will not find it anywhere in Gods word that water baptism no longer exist!

You will not find it anywhere in Paul's letters where water baptism is mentioned:-D All the baptisms mentioned by him are of the Spirit.

Don't you think Paul would have mentioned it? I think so.

[foundinHim]

Dear allthingspure...Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, "Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost." Where does this verse say anything about water baptism?

The Lord Jesus Himself says to Nicodemus, a Pharisee, in John 3:5-7 Jesus answered, "Verily, verily, I say unto thee, except a man be born of water and of the spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Marvel not that I said ubto thee, ye must be born again.

Do you not see that these verses are part of the kingdom message? It is not for us, in the body of Christ(the true church of God)! The water Christ speaks of is "spiritual water." Since you do not "rightly" divide "rightly"---you take this word "water" and say it means "earthly water". Do you not realize that you mix "law" and "grace"? Read and study Romans chapters 1-8.

When I speak of ordinances...I was speaking of rituals, rules, ordinances, and all the traditions of men. There are many congregations and assemblies that say that those who want to belong, have to be water baptized. In the body of Christ, it is not necessary to be saved/spiritually reborn following any man's traditions or ordinances.

On a more personal note---if any one believes they feel the need to be baptized with water(earthly), for a show of their faith---go ahead. I personally, was baptized as an infant, that was my earthly parents decision, they made for me; and when I became an adult, yet I was a babe in Christ, I got baptized in water (full immersion) and I was instructed by the pastor that when I came up, out of the water, that I should emerge speaking in tongues---but that is another issue...an issue that causes much confusion and division. Upon studying God's Word, I know and believe that Christ the Living Word is also Christ the Living Water and I seek God's approval only, not man's.

I agree with you completely when you say "A true believer believes every Word that comes from God!" But before you post inflammatory statements like "a person who denies water baptism does not believe"...my reply is---"So you say!" Only God knows our hearts and knows if our motives are sincere and out of faith-obedience and love for Him. Ask for more guidance and teaching from the Holy Spirit when applying His precept, "rightly dividing". I can see by some of your posts that you haven't quite grasped it fully or "rightly". It seems that you study by using the principle of Biblical hermeneutics, which is admirable.

May God bless you richly with His grace and knowledge of Him!!!

[Gabriel]

You will not find it anywhere in Paul's letters where water baptism is mentioned:-D All the baptisms mentioned by him are of the Spirit.

Don't you think Paul would have mentioned it? I think so.

Are you certain of this?
What about 1 Cor 1:14-16?
14 I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius;
15 Lest any should say that I had baptized in mine own name.
16 And I baptized also the household of Stephanas: besides, I know not whether I baptized any other.

We see here that Paul baptized Crispus (perhaps the same man mentioned in acts 18:8), Gaius (spoken of in Rom 16:23) and the houshold of Stephanas (Rom 16:15,17). We know that only God can baptise with the Holy Spirit yet Paul was claiming that he baptized a few people. This had to be with water. I don't think Paul would have taken credit for these baptisms if these were spiritual baptisms from God. He would have undoubtly said that God had baptised them with His Spirit. But he doesn't, he said "I" baptised.

[allthingspure]

...Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, "Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost."

You asked >>Where does this verse say anything about water baptism?

The word baptized in Greek ....baptidzo meaning to make whelmed (or fully wet) If Peter did not mean water baptism why would he say "be baptized" and then turn around and say "and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost", If he were speaking of the same baptism of the Spirit?
Acts 22:16 >And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized,and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

When Jesus died on the cross He said it is finished..the law of the Old Testament was done away with. We know that! Before Jesus ascended into the heavens He told the disciples what they must do, this had nothing to do with the Old laws ..this is what Gods Church is built upon.
Matthew 28:19-20> Go ye therefore, and teach all Nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father,and the Son, and the Holy Ghost: Teaching them to Observe All things whatsoever I have commanded you:and lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world.Amen!
First He said Go,then Teach,then Baptize them! Jesus was speaking of water baptism. He would Not tell His disciples to baptize them with the Spirit..only Jesus can do that!!

This is what Jesus commanded His disciples to do, He did not ask them to do it He told them! And If we want to be a part of Gods Church we must believe and obey the Gospel of Jesus Christ and the teachings that He told His disciples to teach.
Being baptized is Not a ritual! It is obeying Gods word! It is being buried with Christ...It is for the remission of sins..after Jesus come from the grave He told His disciples..whosoever sins ye remit they are remitted..
We must be buried with Him by (water) baptism and we will then be resurrected with Him by the baptism of the Holy Ghost!
We must be buried in the likeness of His death.

We are told to rightly divide Gods word...line upon line precept upon precept here a little there a little. Rightly divide does not mean "take out the part we dont like" or perhaps the part that we don't understand.

Mark 16:15 -16 > And He (Jesus)said unto them,( His diciples)
Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved: but he that believeth not shall be damned.
Now I ask since when did Jesus change His mind about this?
To be a part of Gods Church we must obey His words. If we do not then we are Not part of His church,we do not need to deceive ourselves.
Yes the blood of Christ cleanses us fron the sin IF we obey His commandments. Which is to first Believe then repent and be baptized in His name for the remission of sins and then we will receive the gift of the Holy Ghost which is spiritual baptism:)

May the Lord give you wisdom, knowledge and understanding to know Him in the power of the Spirit :)

allthingspure

[Jazzmeblue]

Wherever you choose to be baptised at, according to the word of God, you must be baptised in the name of Jesus, fully emerged. I would recommend finding an Apostolic assembly with a Pastor that believes this way.

[Led]

John the Baptist baptized unto repentence Matt. 3:11 "I indeed baptize you with water unto repentence: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:"
Never will you find that water baptism was done away with!

Yes it is. Look at the scripture. John baptized with water BUT Jesus baptizes with the Holy Spirit.

The word "but" indicates another way.
John - with water.
Jesus - with Holy Spirit.

[allthingspure]

Led that simply means John used water,whereas Jesus baptizes us with the spirit. John baptized unto "repentence", but after Jesus ascended the disciples began to baptize "for the remission of those sins."
Jesus would not have told His disciples to "Go baptizing those who believe" if baptism were not important. If baptism would have been done away with Jesus would have said so, just like He said the Laws of the Old Testament were done away with.
The only changes that were made concerning baptism was, instead of baptism unto repentence we are now baptized for the remission of sins in Jesus' name.You will find that in Acts 19.

God Bless You ! :)
allthingspure

[Curt]

Allthingspure, you are correct in the meaning of baptizo (immerse or wash).

It would be interesting if churches would put aside "altar call" and started baptizing right there after the service. I think this would be more Biblical. :-)


Curt

[Led]

Baptizo does mean wash, to clean.

But it's the blood of Jesus which now cleanses us through confession to the Father. It's the blood that takes away our sin and not water.

1 John 1:7-9 "if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin.

8If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness".

To cleanse our sins was the very reason why Christ shed His blood.

[Curt]

Right on bro, I agree.

Curt